There certainly is a direct line to be drawn between the work of American Evangelicals like Scott Lively and the brutal murder of Ugandan LGBT activist David Kato.
Joe Jervis points us to last year’s New York Times profile of Lively’s work in Uganda:
The three Americans who spoke at the conference — Scott Lively, a missionary who has written several books against homosexuality, including “7 Steps to Recruit-Proof Your Child”; Caleb Lee Brundidge, a self-described former gay man who leads “healing seminars”; and Don Schmierer, a board member of Exodus International, whose mission is “mobilizing the body of Christ to minister grace and truth to a world impacted by homosexuality” — are now trying to distance themselves from the bill.
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Mr. Lively and Mr. Brundidge have made similar remarks in interviews or statements issued by their organizations. But the Ugandan organizers of the conference admit helping draft the bill, and Mr. Lively has acknowledged meeting with Ugandan lawmakers to discuss it. He even wrote on his blog in March that someone had likened their campaign to “a nuclear bomb against the gay agenda in Uganda.” Later, when confronted with criticism, Mr. Lively said he was very disappointed that the legislation was so harsh. Human rights advocates in Uganda say the visit by the three Americans helped set in motion what could be a very dangerous cycle. Gay Ugandans already describe a world of beatings, blackmail, death threats like “Die Sodomite!” scrawled on their homes, constant harassment and even so-called correctional rape.
Then Joe ties it all up with a bow:
Yesterday Scott Lively’s “nuclear bomb” against Ugandan gays went off in the form of the iron bar which crushed the skull of David Kato. In some countries, it’s possible that Lively would be under arrest today. Also complicit in this murder is Peter LaBarbera, who for years has worked to publicize and praise Scott Lively’s evil agenda. Then there’s Tony Perkins and the Family Research Council, who last year paid lobbyists $25,000 to convince members of Congress to block a planned resolution denouncing Uganda’s gay death penalty bill. And let’s not forget Pastor Rick Warren, who supported, funded, appeared with, and publicized the work of Uganda’s leading anti-gay activist, Pastor Martin Ssempa.
Rhetoric matters. And as much as hate group leaders like Lively and LaBarbera bitch, moan and try to create false equivalencies wherein the Left are the “Real Haters,” the fact of the matter remains that there is a bodycount on just one side. Meanwhile, Christian Right stories of victimization are usually somewhere between tall tales and melodramatic crying about having to play by the same rules as everyone else.
Yes — and he should be indicted.
Yes — they all have blood on their hands. Didn’t these mfers know what the result of their’ hate the gays’ campaign would be?–especially in a place like africa!
Yes. I consider him complicit and would love to see him tried for crimes against humanity.
One word: Scumbag. What a sick mind that must reside in that man’s head.
Yes. The murder of gays and those who support them was clearly his goal. No one would take him seriously in the U. S. because he is so clearly idiotic, so he had to travel to a developing country to spread his poison.
Yes. Yes. And yes again.
The world is a village now. To all the homphobes out there, you can’t hide. Things will catch up on you.
This tragic death will leave a long bloody smear on anything these three men touch forever more.
I would agree with Joe’s assessment until he mentions Rick Warren. It’s true that Pastor Warren was one of the early supporters of Pastor Ssempa in the 1990′s. He promoted loving the sinner while counseling them to give up their sinful ways. In 2008 when Pastor Ssempa began talking about criminal punishment as a way to force gays into “treatment” programs, Pastor Warren disassociated himself with Pastor Ssempa and ended funding his church.
No one should include Rick Warren as someone responsible for today’s ugliness because of his past support for this pastor when Pastor Warren abandoned Pastor Ssempa back when this ugliness first appeared.
Don’t forget Lou Engle!
Rick Warren has stayed involved with Uganda all the way through, so I wouldn’t be too quick to dismiss him. Warren has always been very two-faced about what he supports, depending on his audience. He couldn’t pull off Fluffy Happy Jesus Pastor in Southern California if he was too hardcore about things like that when he’s in front of American cameras. But his record when he goes abroad is a lot more unsightly.
Bill Ware, while I don’t think Rick Warren can be held legally responsible–his unquestioning support of this evil–up until he got some bad publicity about it–and his continuing, though less public support certainly makes him at least partly responisble morally. I know Christians don’t like to accept the moral responsibility for the hate they spread–Warren should have used his great media power to stop this ugliness. He should have seen where this ugliness was going from the beginning instead of trying to hide his ties.
It’s true the Pastor Warren has maintained his decades long ties to pastors in Uganda. Yet it has been to dissuade them from supporting the anti-homosexual bill, which he refers to as un-Christian.
Please review this video which he sent to Ugandan pastors in Dec, 2009 condemning this ugliness before you claim that he had anything to do with promoting this legislation. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_profilepage&v=1jmGu9o4fDE
Also, we have a Time magazine article titled:
“Rick Warren Denounces Uganda’s Anti-Gay Bill”
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1946921,00.html
Not enough Bill Ware. He did more than make a single video to encourage this hatred in Uganda–he should do more than make a video to prevent it.
Bill, I understand that you are simply trying to be fair minded regarding Warren, and I understand that. Perhaps you attend his church or have been inspired by his books, videos, etc. I grew up going to Mariners, a very large church nearby Saddleback, and I watched Saddleback’s start-up and growth over the years. I’ve known and do know many people who attend Saddleback, have encountered a large number of congregants during protests at and throughout the surrounding areas where Saddleback stands, and I have watched Saddleback and kept up with Rick Warren’s positions, simply because he resides in my own backyard and his positions impact a number of my “neighbors.”
I am not anti-Christian, have found and attend a welcoming and amazing church with an exceedingly informed and supportive pastor at The Church of the Foothills in Tustin, where I serve as the director their Open and Affirming Ministry. I do stand against all types of Fundamentalism and extremism that warps the minds and blinds those who fall into that type of philosophy.
Having said all that, let me clarify what Rick Warren’s position has been. Warren did, indeed, go into Uganda, as well as other areas of Africa. After his first trip there, he gave an interview to the press, and he said of his visit: “I got to see the face of Aids, and I saw that it wasn’t just some white gay guy.” He repeated this sentiment in various iterations through various interviews for weeks and months.
So what does that position say to the gay community here–the gay community in the US that sat by and held the hands of suffering and dying brothers, friends and lovers as our church and political leaders remained silent, except to occasionally remark that it was God’s punishment of our community? Well, it says, Bill, that AIDs was fine, was justified punishment, was to be dismissed when it affected just gay guys. When did he get involved in the fight against AIDs? When Bono pressed him to, when a great photo op presented itself, and when it affected a large swath of heterosexuals in Africa.
When the “Kill the Gays Bill” began to get press here, and the press finally caught up to the fact that among the other Evangelicals that were involved in Uganda was Warren, they asked him what his position was. His very FIRST response was, “Well, I don’t really get involved in the politics of foreign governments.” This is a position he used during the Proposition 8 campaign, when he claimed that he wasn’t urging a political position on the amendment until a video of him surfaced, a video he himself made and released online to all his followers, in which he said that Christians “must” pass Proposition 8. When I say that Warren failed to take a position on the “Kill the Gays Bill,” I mean that he said this when pressed, not one time, but in a number of interviews that stretched on for weeks, until the pressure became too great for him to maintain his image as the laid back, happy, Hawaiian shirt wearing pastor.
Only once it became absolutely clear his image was beginning to crack, and once another video surfaced in which he advised women that the ONLY reason to divorce their husbands was adultery, that domestic abuse/violence was something to endure and work through, did Rick Warren take a position condemning the “Kill the Gays Bill.”
Does Rick Warren do good through some of his ministries? Sure, but what the impetus is remains unclear to those who keep their finger on his pulse and try to remain objective. He seems to be a bit like Martha Stewart in this regard: the image they present is one thing, but their true characters when the cameras are off, when the book jackets are closed are really something else. Stewart was asked about this by Matt Lauer, and she admirably admitted that she sold to her audience the cookie baking homemaker, for that was her product, but in reality she ran a multi-million/billion multi-media corporation, and like all CEOs of major business entities, she was a tough a business woman. Rick Warren’s product is a jovial, slightly paunchy, Hawaiian shirt wearing Pastor, which in Orange County, CA is highly relatable to the vast majority of straight men and their wives and girlfriends, and which is an image that is able to reach beyond the “Orange Curtain” and touch the masses looking for a friendly preacher to guide them…not necessarily challenge them much. Behind closed doors, he is said to wear expensive suits and is a tough business man in meetings. Like Stewart, he has a brand to maintain and an image to be protected, but he is a business man.
Yet, his message is largely the same, Bill, as the countless Evangelical preachers out there who take a very literal and patriarchal approach to scripture (in other words, an approach wherein historical context and translation take a back seat to what is simply easier for a novice Bible reader to understand in a Sunday service). We can see from his various positions (which may be evolving, only Warren truly can know in his heart, but I remain suspicious) that women remain second class citizens of sorts, and that homosexuals are condemned sinners, unworthy of God’s grace.
In a way, Bill, he is the softer and friendly Falwell of his generation, making him not terribly remarkable among Evangelicals, just more popular.
Interesting analysis Mike.
“he advised women that the ONLY reason to divorce their husbands was adultery, that domestic abuse/violence was something to endure and work through…”.
To me, and I suspect many other women, domestic abuse and violence would be a worse crime than adultery and a greater justification for divorce. I can’t understand why one would think adultery justifies divorce but domestic violence does not.
Because a book written by bronze age, sheep-herding nomads tells us so!
Bill Ware: Rick Warren is one of the militant, anti American fundamentalists who paid Ugandan preachers to start stirring up venomous heterosexism and AIDSphobia in that country. His disavowal of Ssempa was good PR in the US, but it was an empty gesture at that point.
[...] suspects, are triumphantly asking for apologies from the mainstream media and gay activists for bringing up the rhetoric of Scott Lively in connection with the murder of Ugandan gay activist David Kato. Why are they so happy? Media [...]
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