Today, nationally-syndicated progressive radio host David Pakman interviewed Michael Brown, a self-proclaimed “expert” on the issue of marriage and why loving same-sex couples should be excluded from it. For those of you not familiar with Michael Brown (we’ve covered him before), he’s one of the most vile homophobes in America. He spreads his toxic bigotry on his daily radio show, “Line of Fire,” and through his catalog of more than twenty books, including his latest, A Queer Thing Happened to America, which Brown self-published in 2011 because no publishing house thought it was fit to print. Perhaps most insidiously, Brown also likes to invade LGBT Pride festivals with gangs of fundamentalist Christian theocrats who wear anti-gay T-shirts and hand out homophobic religious tracts, attempting to shame LGBT people on what is supposed to be a day of affirmation and celebration.
As usual, David’s done his homework, calmly citing, among other things, the oeuvre of prominent Yale historian John Boswell, who wrote prolifically about the intersection of LGBT issues and religion. Brown’s only response is to dismiss Boswell completely, because after all (as Brown says), he “practically died of AIDS.”
And it only goes downhill from there. When Pakman challenges Brown’s tired (and totally discredited) talking point about the immutability of the historical definition of marriage, Brown resorts to condescension. Check out the video below — he tries to lecture Pakman on how to prepare for an interview, seizing the opportunity to hawk his self-published book (which, apparently, must be a respectable source, despite the fact that no publishing house — reputable or otherwise — would print it, because it includes “1500+ endnotes and massive research.” (Hmmmm, overcompensating much?) When Pakman presses Brown further to cite the specific sources he drew upon to formulate his exclusionary “historical definition of marriage,” he suddenly chickens out remembers that he has something else to do, saying that he didn’t realize this wasn’t a “serious interview” and mischaracterizing Pakman as a ‘gotcha’ journalist out to “[set] people up for quotes.” Then, after essentially telling Pakman again to read his book before he conducts any further interviews with him, Brown hangs up.
I’ve long been appalled by Michael Brown’s putrid bigotry, but after watching his disgustingly smarmy performance on today’s episode of the David Pakman Show, I’m also aghast at such a blatant, cowardly display of ageism. I highly doubt Brown would have behaved nearly as dismissively to a journalist closer to his own age, but apparently, when it’s a young person handing his you-know-what to him, Michael Brown has no problem resorting to ageist, ad hominem attacks.
Kudos to David Pakman for keeping his cool, sticking to his guns, and being persistent in his attempt to hold Michael Brown accountable for his distortions of the truth. Watch the video below — you won’t believe it.
I like it how you disagree with me on everything. I thought at one point that you might actually have a valid opinion, but then I realize you just want to disagree with me on EVERYTHING. So I guess you don’t believe history is in favor of GLBT rights in the long run. Glad to hear it!
I guess someone around here has to ask all of the stupid rhetorical questions. I’m not responding to any of your comments to me; don’t write them, I won’t read them.
My advice? Invest in Xanax, it might do you good.
G’night
Yes yes. Misrepresent your opponent’s comment then run away because you know you can’t make an argument on its own merits. Typical.
I just clicked on Eric Miller’s link to his own website.
He has called it “Unpretentious Spiritual Musings” !
What a total misnomer.
Eric, the very fact you felt you had to call your musings/rants ‘Unpretentious’ indicates that this site is anything but.
Hi Richard,
I’m glad that you aren’t violently offended by LGBT equality and chose to respond nicely to me. However, I would disagree with your characterization. I would say there are three groups, those who support, those who don’t care and those who reject. Those who support (like most of us) would actively like to see an equal world. Those who reject would like to see us back in the closet or dead, at least held inferior. Those who don’t care really don’t care. They aren’t campaigning but the general attitude is “live and let live” and “I don’t care what the gay couple next door does in the bedroom.” Do you care what the gay couple does in their own bedroom? If you don’t, there’s no reason to oppose equality. If you do care, you shouldn’t characterize yourself as not caring.
Emma
Wingnut Richard said “Always feel free to NOT call me a bigot, simply because I disagree with you.”.
Of course, the ever present anti-gay lie. We’re not calling you a bigot simply because you disagree with us Richard. We’re calling you a bigot because you advocate denying equal rights to an innocent and harmeless minority.
Given the huge sums of time and money the anti-gays put into fighting gay equality its clearly not the case that they “don’t give a rat’s *ss”.
Wingnut Richard said to Rainbowphoenix “I like it how you disagree with me on everything. I thought at one point that you might actually have a valid opinion, but then I realize you just want to disagree with me on EVERYTHING.”.
Again with the victimhood lies. You and Rainbow haven’t remotely even begun to discuss everything so to call your comment an outrageous exageration wouldn’t do justice to how wrong it is. You only come here trying to justify oppressing gays, demonizing gays, and denying them equal rights. Of course we disagree with you on that, you can’t rationally expect otherwise. But to say we disagree with you unconditionally on every topic is just painfully childish – grow up wing-nut.
They only discuss two things before it disintegraes.
Boswell: Brown attempted to dismiss Boswell. Pakman indicated there were all kinds of examples of homosexual marriage in the Bible (I don’t know if he meant that–or if he was referring to church history). But Brown did not close the door to discussing Boswell. Pakman just moved on.
Legal definition of marriage: Brown asserts the meaning of “marriage” in the law in the United States (until very recent decisions) has been “male” and “female.” Which is of course why no court has come to work some Monday morning and rendered the term as having no historical meaning.
I like Pakman’s raising the question: “Why presume the meaning of marriage?” Brown ought have answered. But in fairness all language (and all evidence) can quickly be rendered meaningless (e.g. as practiced everyday by every good defense attorney); and it is one of the simplest ways to close down conversation. I believe good interviews clarify definitions — but they don’t push symbols (e.g. language) into meaninglessness. When they do the discussion will go nowhere–so Brown was right to cease the interview–and wrong to be so condescending. I would say they were equally arrogant–but Pakman more professional.
@ERIC MILLER,
I’d believe that any of these evangelicals were serious about eradicating what’s BAD in the world, if they spent more time dealing directly with DOMESTIC violence issues. I don’t seen them shouting and picketing in GANG member’s territory. I never see them setting up any political action against states that still allow marriages between minor girls and grown men. It’s taken many multi millions of dollars for anti gay politics, as well as taking millions from gay citizens to defend themselves.
And all the while, NONE of this discrimination helps anything, protects anything.
It works the way Jim Crow did. It has NO moral value, it only maintains unfair advantage over an already vulnerable group.
I NEVER see people like Brown volunteering or working where I work.
I’ve given MY cred working around THE most dangerous and reprobate people, who STILL have more rights to marry than law abiding, responsible gay people do.
So this isn’t about a moral imperative to discriminate.
All things considered Eric, gays and lesbians have ONLY responded to this outrage with non violent means and through due process of law.
If some of us get impatient, angry, and show our pain and outrage at WHO IS RESPONSIBLE for it, then it’s showing our humanity and passion and moral courage.
THIS is RIGHTEOUS indignation.
We can claim a life or death factor with regard to anti gay sentiment out there.
While Brown is claiming being a victim of gays HE drew first blood from.
Perhaps you’re not old enough to remember how things were on the issue of de segregation and the public’s AWARENESS of what blacks actually went through and how in denial or indifferent people could be to the pain they inflicted or witnessed.
And perhaps you’ve never really had the strength it takes to deal with the worst of people like Brown. I have no idea.
But he’s indefensible and this is a BLOG.
Brown KNOWS he’ll never pay anything for what he’s cashed. He KNOWS it.
And it wouldn’t KILL him if someone TELLS him, or tells others.
Big f*****g difference. Know it.
Eric’s response to Emma shows how he tried to change the subject from the actual outcomes of his anti-gay agenda to “courtesy”. Since he’s being “nice” somehow it’s supposed to make it okay he’s working to take away our rights.
For someone who doesn’t give a rat’s a$$ he spends a lot of time on this site.
Eric Miller: I had a look over the “unpretentious spiritual musings” on your blog, so I’m considering the source. As noted by a previous commenter, the disclaimer shows a certain cognitive dissonance; i.e., “out of touch with reality.” The pieces are long, bloviational (nice word), and bombastic.
That aside, Kathy Verbiest Baldock at Canyon Walker Connection did an excellent chapter-by-chapter examination of Ol’ Doc Brown’s “Queer Thing” dreck-tome. I recommend it highly.
P.S. Priya Lynn, I love you madly. And Regan Du Casse.
P.P.S. Yes, I know, I’m WAY late to the conversation, and in re-reading the postings, I see that much of this is redundant. Such is life.
Thanks Reed ; )
Love you back, Reed. You KNOW it, brother! xo
@Eric. “come to Jesus”. Answer- No. I do not recognize your “sins” therefore you nor your god have power over me. Poof, be gone with ye.