Here is a clip from the Values Voter Summit 2012. Gary Bauer, once again, bears false witness in the name of God. Is there anything that this man says that is truthful?
And, by the way, liberty comes from government. If liberty came from God, then women in Saudi Arabia would be driving and women would have the ability to run Vatican City. Russia is more religious than — ever — yet its people are less politically and socially free every day. Please explain these contradictions Mr. Bauer.
Only a dolt would conclude that liberty and freedom don’t come from government — but that is a standard talking point from extremists these days
It may be that you want to believe that God is the ‘author’ of a lot of things, but man through his governance dispenses, or not, such liberties. Look at ‘marriage equality’. It is “you” religious kooks who want the decision making authority over it. Gay people are not the ones you like so they shall not be your equal. Where is God in all that? Certainly not on the side of liberty, justice, equality. MAN is the arbiter of all those rights/benefits.
“Only a dolt would conclude that liberty and freedom don’t come from government”
Officer and crazy, suicidal murderer face off. Criminal raises his gun. Officer fires and kills the man. Would only a dolt conclude that authority flowed from an authority higher than the officer???? Would only a dolt roll out of bed in the morning and have a thought that they were made by someone other than themself??
Yes Melinda, only a dolt would think that.
“Would only a dolt conclude that authority flowed from an authority higher than the officer????”
Not at all. Any one with a passing knowledge of society, police, government, and crime would know that the authority to act as he does indeed flows from a higher authority than the officer himself.
But that’s not the same thing as the DECISION to act as he does. That he does on his own authority. The higher “authority” has merely guaranteed there will be no legal consequences for the officer for doing what might be a crime otherwise.
“Would only a dolt roll out of bed in the morning and have a thought that they were made by someone other than themself??”
Never good to argue by analogy, if that’s all you have. And you don’t even have a good one. A dolt might roll out of bed and have that thought. So might an intelligent person. That doesn’t mean either of them is right or wrong. They both have the same kind and amount of evidence available to them. What does it have to do with the morality of one’s actions? Not a thing. And even less so when your standard of judgment about what constitutes the creators intentions for and message to us is a book written 2000 years ago, edited, redacted, tranlated, politicized, and propagandized.
Only a dolt would conclude that the existence of a creator proves he/she/it is exactly the same as your particular version of he/she/it.
As God said in the Book of common sense, “You don’t understand what I said to Paul 2000 years ago. Neither did he. You’re not arguing about what I said. you’re arguing about what you think HE said. I told you to love one another, treat others as you would like to be treated, and not to judge other people.”
What does that have to do with liberty and freedom? Not a thing. If free will is real, god has offered us the freedom to be unfree, the liberty to deny liberty. And it is indeed the State that determines who has liberty and freedom, who does not.
The proof is very simple.
You don’t ask God to put the filthy sodomites in jail, you ask the state to. you cite the law that they have broekn, convict them of unrepentent sodomy, and put them in a prison run by the state. God’s interests remain unstated, except by a certian class of his adherents.
You don’t ask God to deny marriage equality to unrepentant sinners. You pass a law. It just so happens you don’t deny marriage to divorced people or admitted adulterers, mass murderers or congressmen, just gay people. God’s assent or dissent is simply irrelevant.
When God actually speaks to human kind, I expect it will be in a clear, unequivocal voice that NO ONE CAN DENY IS THE VOICE OF GOD.
Because otherwise, I don’t hear God talking. I only hear you talking– the voices of those who wish to have dominion over others, claim it is about love when it has nothing to with love, and justify it as the word of god.
I have yet to find anyplace in the constitution where it says that gay citizens must, as a matter of law and society, be treated differently than straight citizens. and i certainly see no place in the bible that says that homosexual sinners must, as a matter of faith and morals, be treated differnetly than heterosexual sinners, or homo-hating-homo sinners who really wanna be straight, but ain’t.