In California, Gov. Jerry Brown recently signed SB 1172 that stops quack therapists from practicing dangerous “ex-gay” techniques on minors. This is great news, considering the American Psychiatric Association says that such practices can lead to “anxiety, depression, and self-destructive behavior.” Why would any responsible state allow children to be subjected to such child abuse that may lead to suicide?
Now that California has elected to protect kids from quacks, several states are considering passing similar measures in 2013. Stung by the California defeat and worried about their future, the lucrative “ex-gay” industry is launching a PR offensive to stop new laws from being passed in states and even at the federal level. The first shot in this PR war is the launching of the “ex-gay” website Voices of Change which is being promoted by the National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality (NARTH) and People Can Change (PCC), an organization with close ties to discredited laughingstock Richard Cohen. This new, website contains a video from NARTH co-founder Dr. Joseph Nicolosi where he claims that half of all his clients are teenagers.
“We are getting more an more teenagers coming to our clinic,” said NARTH’s Dr. Joseph Nicolosi. “Years ago when I did this work, the average age of our clients was late 20′s and early 30′s…Today, I would say that 50-percent of the clients at our clinic, and we have 135 ongoing cases a week. We have seven therapists that only deal with homosexuality. Fifty percent are teenagers.”
If this weren’t disconcerting enough, Cohen’s International Healing Foundation (IHF) has received a huge infusion of cash to target desperate and vulnerable LGBT youth. More than $635,000 was donated to IHF in 2011, with most of the funds allocated for group’s “Special Schools Project.” This appears to be an effort to con school districts into believing that IHF is a pro-gay organization that stands for diversity and is opposed to bullying. However, the group’s dishonest materials cunningly try to steer LGBT youth to “ex-gay” organizations.
Today’s New York Times story written by reporter Erik Eckholm is set in the middle of this ongoing fight. It focuses on the marketing efforts of “ex-gay” activists to try to trick Americans into believing they have gone from gay to straight. Fortunately, it seems that some of the people who commented on the Times’ website today saw through the “ex-gay” charade:
It doesn’t seem like these men are ‘not gay,’ it just seems they are no longer sexually active with other men. If these were the best examples of people ‘cured,’ then the results speak for themselves. Celibacy is not the same thing as heterosexual. – Julia Pappas-Fidicia, New York City
As a Clinical Psychologist who has written on ‘reparative therapy,’ let me offer a suggestion. Those offering reparative therapy should no longer offer it as a therapy of any sort, but instead as a religious ritual or discipline. After all, that’s what L. Ron Hubbard did with Dianetics when he got into trouble offering it as a treatment. He simply turned it into a world religion. Scientology. Let ‘Gay Reparative Therapy’ be the Scientology of Christianity. — Jonathan C. Smith, PhD, Chicago
I feel a great deal of sympathy for these men, who are clearly suffering. I’m sure these treatments are not cheap…They are being taken advantage of by unscrupulous psychologists and ‘therapists.’ – Daisy, Boston
Before we look at this story, I want to share a few thoughts:
First, NARTH — which is the leading “ex-gay” organization — is to the study of sexual orientation what a mood ring is to the science of depression. Ex-Gay practices are a fringe PR gimmick designed to trick a majority of voters into believing that gay people can change so they can rationalize discrimination and justify poor treatment. Here are two very telling quotes that capture the real views of NARTH:
“Homosexuality is a psychological disorder, there is no question about it,” said NARTH co-founder, the late Charles Socarides. “It is a purple menace that is threatening the proper design of gender distinctions in society.” – Weiss, Rick (1997) Psychologists reconsider gay conversion therapy, The Washington Post, Aug. 14
“The most important message we can offer is that there is that there is such thing as a ‘gay child’ or a ‘gay teen.’ We are all designed to be heterosexual. Confusion about gender is primarily a psychological condition, and to some extent, it can be modified.” (p. 16) A Parent’s Guide to Preventing Homosexuality, Joseph and Linda Ames Nicolosi (2002)
In the first quote, Socarides reveals NARTH’s true hostility by calling homosexuality a “purple menace.” Now, I’m not a psychiatrist, but I suspect that the phrase “purple menace” appears nowhere in the literature at top universities where future mental health experts are trained.
In the second quote, Nicolosi uses the phrase “designed to be heterosexuals.” Designed by whom? They are clearly talking about God. Reparative therapy is a discredited practice because of its theological origins masquerading as science. Where genuine science seeks to explore the natural world in hope of discovering answers, reparative therapy is the opposite because it starts with a prepackaged theological answer and gropes for verbiage to justify its preordained conclusion. The prospect for learning and observation are non-existent, since all results have to conclude that homosexuality is a purple menace caused by a mental illness that can be fixed. Clearly, reparative therapy is based on the Scripture Method, not the Scientific Method.
The often desperate and vulnerable clients featured in today’s NYT article are extremely susceptible to swaggering “ex-gay” therapists who appear to have all the answers. For many, if the therapy does not work, they will immediately become outcasts in the religious communities they grew up in. They can lose their family. If they are youth they can become homeless. In other words, there can be enormous incentives for claiming transformation, even when it is not true.
This is exacerbated by name it-and-claim it theology shared by many “ex-gay” ministries. The idea is that if you keep repeating something desirable and have faith in God, He will reward you for your faith. Much “ex-gay” testimony can be attributed to such theology which can be summarized as lying to please the Lord. This tradition is a Catch 22, because if you acknowledge not changing, the minister might say, “of course you aren’t changing, you don’t have enough faith.”
Finally, there is also the issue of conflict of interest or “ex-gay” for pay. Leading NARTH defenders, like David Pickup and James Phelan, have a business model they are defending. Because of clear financial incentives, what they claim about change is essentially meaningless — much like those selling products on late night infomercials. It should be noted that it is difficult to find many “ex-gays” who don’t have a conflict of interest, such as running a therapy outfit or a ministry.
Now, on to the New York Times article. It begins with the story of Blake Smith:
Mr. Smith, 58, who says he believes homosexual behavior is wrong on religious grounds, tried to tough it out. He spent 17 years in a doomed marriage while battling his urges all day, he said, and dreaming about them all night.
But in recent years, as he probed his childhood in counseling and at men’s weekend retreats with names like People Can Change and Journey Into Manhood, “my homosexual feelings have nearly vanished,’ Mr. Smith said in an interview at the house in Bakersfield, Calif., he shares with his second wife, who married him eight years ago knowing his history. “In my 50s, for the first time, I can look at a woman and say ‘she’s really hot.’ ”
I pity Blake and his family. How did it make his wife feel when he was pretending to be attracted to her for 17 years while dreaming about men all night? How does arranging such doomed marriages promote family values? It seems that Blake has wasted the majority of his life in denial, selfishly dragging down women into his self-induced shame hell. He deserves to find true love and physical satisfaction, and so do his two wives, past and present. Had he not been indoctrinated with anti-gay religious dogma, he likely would have been much happier, whole, and not viewed his sexuality as a cosmic battle between good and evil. Blake does not represent success, but the neurotic mess that homophobia can make of one’s life. Instead of liberating Blake, he’s in his 50′s still deluding himself at the expense of his family. I’ve seen this story before — where men finally come out in their 60′s and 70′s and ask, “where did my life go?”
I’m going to be blunt: I don’t believe that Blake finds women hot. When it comes to wild claims of creating a heterosexual attraction for homosexuals, “ex-gay” organizations have no credibility and shouldn’t be taken seriously. How many “ex-gay” posterboys have they put forward only to be revealed as frauds? Given the number of high level failures, one would have to be naive to take their tales of change at face value.
The story continues, pointing out two recent disasters for the “ex-gay” myth:
Reparative therapy suffered two other major setbacks this year. In April, a prominent psychiatrist, Dr. Robert L. Spitzer, publicly repudiated as invalid his own 2001 study suggesting that some people could change their sexual orientation; the study had been widely cited by defenders of the therapy.
Then this summer, the ex-gay world was convulsed when Alan Chambers, the president of Exodus International, the largest Christian ministry for people fighting same-sex attraction, said he did not believe anyone could be rid of homosexual desires
I’m a big proponent of using physical measures to test whether such people have gone from gay to straight. (No Lie MRI, polygraph, penile plethysmography). Relying on the tale of an “ex-gay” who often has a financial incentive or is under immense social pressure or religious duress to claim success is a waste of time. Since physical tests exist, why doesn’t NARTH use them? Is Blake willing to take one? If not, what is he hiding?
On the topic of genuine “change,” here is a revealing quote from former Brazilian “ex-gay” poster boy Sergio Viula:
“In fact, ex-gays don’t exist – it’s pure self-suggestion…What we ex-gay purveyors did was an act of violence against ourselves, as we had internalized the homophobia that surrounded us from early childhood, as well as against the others, because we reproduced that very homophobia which they had internalized by themselves long before. We just reinforced it even more.”
Next, the article states:
Mr. Smith is one of thousands of men across the country, often known as “ex-gay,” who believe they have changed their most basic sexual desires through some combination of therapy and prayer — something most scientists say has never been proved possible and is likely an illusion.
The New York Times article actually refutes the “ex-gay” claim that there are thousands of such folks by the people interviewed:
Aaron Bitzer, 35, was so angered by the California ban, which will take effect on Jan. 1, that he went public and became a plaintiff in a lawsuit challenging the law as unconstitutional.
To those who call the therapy dangerous, Mr. Bitzer reverses the argument: “If I’d known about these therapies as a teen I could have avoided a lot of depression, self-hatred and suicidal thoughts,” he said at his apartment in Los Angeles. He was tormented as a Christian teenager by his homosexual attractions, but now, after men’s retreats and an online course of reparative therapy, he says he feels glimmers of attraction for women and is thinking about dating.
“I found that I couldn’t just say ‘I’m gay’ and live that way,” said Mr. Bitzer, who plans to seek a doctorate in psychology and become a therapist himself.
So the posterboy for success that the “ex-gay” industry provides America’s most prestigious newspaper says he feels “glimmers of attraction for women?” If this is the best they can do, it proves the entire “ex-gay” schtick is a public relations campaign, not genuine therapy that produces actual results. For all the boasting, bluster, and bravado, the “ex-gay” industry has virtually no success stories to highlight. For example, when Dr. Robert Spitzer asked NARTH’s Dr. Joseph Nicolosi for subjects to participate in his 2001 study on whether people could go from gay to straight, Nicolosi failed to deliver his allegedly “changed” homosexuals. In a video TWO filmed this year with Spitzer, the psychiatrist claimed:
He [Nicolosi] just didn’t have many patients who could really claim that they had changed.
With a lack of real success stories from actual clients, the “ex-gay” industry is forced to make the preposterous claim that “ex-gays” are invisible because they are afraid to come out of the closet, fearing that people like me might be mean to them. According to the Times story:
Ex-gay men are often closeted, fearing ridicule from gay advocates who accuse them of self-deception and, at the same time, fearing rejection by their church communities as tainted oddities…Many ex-gays guard their secret but quietly meet in support groups around the country, sharing ideas on how to avoid temptations or, perhaps, broach their past with a female date.
Here are a few facts:
The figures show that homosexuals are 2.4 times more likely to suffer a violent hate crime attack than Jews. Gays are 2.6 times more likely to be attacked than blacks; 4.4 times more likely than Muslims; 13.8 times more likely than Latinos; and 41.5 times more likely than whites, according to the FBI figures. Homosexuals are far more likely than any other minority group in the United States to be victimized by violent hate crimes.
Clearly, the consequences of coming out as a gay person can be very real, while there is zero evidence to show that coming out as heterosexual (which is what ex-gays presumably are) is dangerous. Despite the ominous figures, millions of gay people have still managed to come out, even in conservative or rural areas. My spouse came out in a Nebraska town of 700 people. Yet, somehow we are supposed to believe that so-called “ex-gays,” with no evidence that they are victims of hate crimes, are cowed into hiding? Such whining defies logic and is simply the irrational bleating and excuse making of “ex-gay” groups who can’t produce success stories to back their unsubstantiated claims.
Interestingly, the LGBT movement has no trouble showing survivors of such psychological abuse and there are even support groups, like Beyond Ex-Gay.
In short, the “ex-gay” industry is posing as victims when they are actually the victimizers. They are about enforcing rigid gender norms, restrictive stereotypes, and portraying homosexuality in the worst possible light. Far from open minded, the only acceptable outcome for clients in such intolerant programs is heterosexuality. Anyone who comes to a different conclusion is ostracized and stigmatized. It is most amusing that the “ex-gay” industry has recently adopted the liberal arguments of choice, exploration, and self-determination, when in reality these alleged choices are a mirage. What they really offer is heterosexuality or the highway. Who are they kidding?
The truth is, “ex-gay” abuse is about shame and blame. Virtually no one over the age of thirty felt comfortable growing up gay. Even in today’s more accepting society, there are large swaths of America where coming out can mean social death, rejection, and even violence. However, that has nothing to do with one’s homosexuality, but the way people react to it. Reparative therapy adds to the stigma, reinforces a client’s shame, and confuses stereotypes with science. Had the the people featured in this story been brought up in a more accepting environment, then they would have been more comfortable as gay. Homosexuality, like heterosexuality, consists of sexual arousal and feelings of love — two beautiful elements that make life meaningful. The only way it is possible that homosexuality can make one unhappy is if it is portrayed as bad and leads to adverse social consequences. (which is why “ex-gay” groups are in favor of anti-gay laws) The idea that homosexuality on its own can lead to unhappiness is a bizarre and incoherent notion rooted in bias.
What we do know is that acceptance of LGBT youth makes a huge difference on whether they succeed or fail:
San Francisco State researcher Caitlin Ryan found that LGBT teens who experienced negative feedback from their families were 8 times as likely to have attempted suicide, 6 times as vulnerable to severe depression, and 3 times at risk for drug abuse. (Journal of the American Academy of Pediatrics, Jan 2009)
Science is also beginning to show that because of social pressure, there are those who claim to be heterosexual — even homophobic — who are actually gay. Reparative therapy is just another variation of the conditions that strongly encourage false reporting. (We know at least two clients of Nicolosi who were asked to participate in Robert Spitzer’s study who were not transformed, which shows the strong degree of coercion used by the reparative therapy industry)
It is important to note that reparative therapy can temporarily make perfect sense intellectually to a lot of people who fit NARTH’s prefabricated model of what causes homosexuality. If one comes from a home with a distant same-sex parent or was sexually abused, or picked last on sports teams, their paradigm seems to explain everything in a neat and tidy manner. Except it really explains nothing at all and there is no evidence that such family dynamics cause homosexuality any more than an affinity for peanut butter and jelly sandwiches or the enjoyment of Hula Hoops. NARTH’s family model can also describe the experiences of countless heterosexuals. It also conveniently ignores the fact that a great number of LGBT people grew up in loving homes where they were close to both parents. For example, I’m very close to my parents who have been married for 43 years. I was never sexually violated. I grew up bowling, fishing, and playing football. I was the captain of my high school basketball team, MVP, and second team All-City in 1988. When I hear the theories of reparative therapists, I think they are bizarre and have little to do with reality. But, that’s easy for me to conclude, given my background. It’s not so easy for those to figure out who fit neatly into NARTH’s fabricated paradigm and are more easily exploited.
In terms of “ex-gay” industry opening up old wounds by discussing family dynamics, this can be terribly problematic. Unless the counselor is qualified (and many “ex-gay” counselors are not), such unwise actions can cause additional trauma to clients. This is one more reason that LGBT youth should never be subjected to the abuse of such charlatans.
I will also note that initially going to “ex-gay” therapy does bring a sense of relief for some clients. A good portion of them are deeply closeted and have had very little contact with openly gay individuals. Suddenly, they went from complete secrecy, loneliness, and silence, to having their sexual orientation out in the open — even if it is in a dysfunctional faux therapeutic setting. Whether one comes out as gay or “ex-gay” it is still a form of coming out and does bring a sense of peace. However, the same effect can be accomplished in a supportive setting and the glow eventually wears off “ex-gay” counseling when it fails to deliver on its false promise.
One defense for such therapy is this: “I don’t claim this is possible for everyone, but it works for me. What’s wrong with that?”
This is an old huckster technique used to bamboozle gullible people into buying snake oil. The idea is to use personal testimony to claim a product works knowing that such tales are difficult to refute. If one watches late night TV, countless infomercials — from weight loss products to face cream to muscle building formulas — make outrageous claims using personal testimony. The other appealing aspect is that when the product inevitably doesn’t work, the exploited customer can be blamed for not achieving the promised results. Reparative therapy is a con that uses the same tried and true methods of other swindlers. Of course, when it comes to “ex-gay” abuse, when the miracle or change doesn’t come, it can lead to depression or worse, as the victim can’t understand why they are failing. Often, they believe that they were abandoned by God, greatly exacerbating feelings of depression and low self-esteem.
Additionally, no one cares what an adult individual does in his or her private life. The problem arises when so-called “ex-gays” are paraded by political groups on national television and used to testify in an effort to pass anti-gay laws. For example, I started Truth Wins Out in 2006 after George W. Bush invited Exodus’ Alan Chambers to the White House to promote the Federal Marriage Amendment. The “ex-gay” issue only gained traction in 1998 when 16 anti-gay organizations launched the “Truth in Love” campaign with a full-page ad in the New York Times. Indeed, the “ex-gay” issue has never been about changing one’s sexual orientation, but using the idea of change to pass anti-gay laws. “Ex-Gay” activist Greg Quinlan, President of Parents and Friends of Ex-Gays (PFOX) is currently working to overturn a marriage equality in Maryland.
It is also worth mentioning that there is a growing body of science is beginning to show that sexual orientation has biological origins. In many cases, the brains of gay and straight people are subtly different. Anyone or group that makes a blanket statement that sexual orientation is caused by rape or poor parenting doesn’t have a very strong grasp of science, they are not informed on the latest research, or they are deliberately twisting the science for political gain. When groups like NARTH and PFOX makes such statements it reveals a level of ignorance so great that it virtually disqualifies them from even being in the room where serious scientific discussions occur.
I’ll end by featuring the testimony of Cameron Michael Swaim in today’s Times story:
Cameron Michael Swaim, 20, said he is in the early stages of his struggle to overcome homosexual desires. Mr. Swaim is unemployed and lives with his parents in Orange County, Calif., where his father is a pastor of the Evangelical Friends Church of the Southwest.
He tried the gay life, but “it just doesn’t settle with me,” he said, and ultimately decided “there’s got to be a way to heal this affliction.”
Through weekend retreats and participation in a Southern California support group Mr. Swaim has started to explore his family relations, he said, something that has been painful but seems to be helping.
“I’m building my confidence around men,” he said, “ and that has built my confidence around women.”
Five years from now, Mr. Swaim hopes, he will be engaged or married. In the meantime, he is trying to scrape together enough money to start seeing a reparative therapist.
It is a shame that Swaim had the misfortune of being born into a home where he was taught to despise his most intimate feelings and human needs. Had be been born into a better home — one that would have been accepting rather than rejecting — he would not be suffering though the obvious trauma he now endures. It is heartbreaking that he plans to drag a woman into his mess — a woman who surely deserves better than to live his lie. When this future marriage finally falls apart, I urge his ex-wife to contact the Straight Spouse Network. This is a support group for women and men who were often used as props and beards in the destructive game played by the “ex-gay” industry. There is also the book, Straight Wives, Shattered Lives by Bonnie Kaye.
Reparative therapy by nature is coercive. It takes vulnerable people and tries to scare the heck out of them. For example, this comes from pg. 16 of the Nicolosi book, “Preventing Homosexuality“:
- There are life threatening health risks associated with the gay lifestyle
- A gay lifestyle adjustment will be difficult and socially controversial
- Dr. Nicolosi has also told clients: “I do not believe that any man can ever be truly at peace in living out a homosexual orientation.”
Make no mistake, the gross distortions “ex-gay” therapists promulgate about gay life are the key reason people, such as those featured today in the Times, want to change. The charlatans offering help are the ones causing the harm.
The sooner such wanton child abuse can be stopped, the better.
Great post, Wayne.
Thanks Priya
Wayne, I’d recommend reading the entire comments section for that article. There are over 300 and counting, and they’re nearly unanimous in trashing ex-gay therapy for the religiously-charged joke that it is.
That, for me, is the consolation at the end of the day. You are correct in pointing out that the ex-gay movement is grasping for straws (read: relevance), thus they’re trying to counter that by launching a massive PR blitz (such as this article and the newly-formed Restored Hope Network which you covered a few months back).
But my personal opinion is that a PR blitz is ALL it is. The ex-gay movement may have mobilized several years ago in the shadow of Bush’s support for a federal marriage amendment, but they sure crashed and burned rather quickly (and spectacularly) in a rather short time.
The good news is that even more Americans know what “pray away the gay” is and more importantly, that is simply dosen’t work, than ever before. With each passing day, support for gay rights and marriage equality increases. There’s really no turning back now.
I know you’re concerned about these high-profile stories and you’re upset that people like Cohen are trying to blitzkrieg the public schools with ex-gay materials disguised as anti-bullying pamphlets. I’m upset too, but not at all surprised. Religious types have been trying to get pro-life and pro-creationist materials into public schools for decades. It’s nothing new.
My main concern is that all of the supers in all of these public schools know what these materials are and how to deal with them.
As long as there’s people like you continuously kicking over the rocks that these miscreants try to hide under, shining bright lights on them and calling them on their b.s., then they’ll continue to spiral downwards.
Nobody with half a brain would look at a creationist pamphlet and confuse it for anything other than religious propoganda. Same goes for ex-gay therapy. With each passing day, Americans are becoming better informed about this issue, and know that ex-gay therapy isn’t grounded in ANY type of secular or progressive ideas. It’s 100%-church based.
Wayne, if you go look at Throckmorton’s website you will find that same Jeremy from the NY Times article commenting on Warren’s Journey Into Manhood articles. He is an actor, literally like a professional actor. He gave a link to his personal website but then later on deleted all the information. He commented on several articles at Throckmorton’s blog. It’s sad really how sucked into this ex-gay myth he is.
He commented on multiple articles.
I wonder if these people joining a class action lawsuit are aware that they are still free to take part any sort of quack therapy they wish. As for our children, they are protected from this sort of trash faith-healing BS. I love how their comments always end with “…and I feel like I might be attracted to a woman any minute!”
WOW – Besen is so biased it’s difficult to take this article serious.I worked with three people who identified themselves as gay and lesbian, who no longer are in same sex relationships and claim to be doing fine. One guy is married with 3 kids – he was molested when he was young and struggled with same-sex attractions from pre-teen years until he was in his mid 20′s. Therapy seemed to really help him. He’s shared his story in detail with me. People who are not comfortable with their “same-sex” feelings or attractions should be able to pursue therapy.
Dr. Caroline Leaf has done some great studies on brain chemistry and “rewiring” the brain. Another twin gene study I read drew some interesting conclusions too – that genes can be “turned on” by behavior. I have met guys and girls who seemed “gay to the core”, but I think it is WRONG and POLITICALLY MOTIVATED to deny people who aren’t happy as gay people the right to therapy and support. P.S. I am not a “hater”.
Show us your clients’ tumescense exams, otherwise you have no credibility here.
Although I disagree with the thrust of his argument (that conversion therapy should be legal and acceptable), Mike does have one point worth considering. Some male survivors of childhood sexual abuse do experience confusion about their sexual orientation and wonder if they are gay or even come to identify as being gay when, after they receive appropriate psychotherapy, they conclude that they are heterosexual.
However, such individuals do not need gay conversion therapists, organizations, or political movements to receive help. They simply need to see a reputable psychologist who specializes in psychotherapy with male sexual abuse survivors. Such psychologists do not subscribe to the conversion therapy philosophy and do not support the political agenda of the conversion therapy industry. They practice gay affirmative psychotherapy when working with gay patients.
And these psychologists also recognize that some male sexual abuse survivors were heterosexual to begin with, but experience sexual identity confusion or, less commonly, even identify as “gay,” as a result of the abuse. There are various psychodynamic reasons for such mistaken sexual orientation identification that I won’t go into detail here (but see the article I mention below).
Importantly such psychologists also recognize that some male sexual abuse survivors were gay to begin with, but experience sexual identity confusion, often because of the predominant myth that “a boy who is abused by a man is made gay by the abuse.” (The survivor questions if he “is gay because I was abused” when, in fact, he was gay regardless of the abuse.)
Some male sexual abuse survivors may seek out psychotherapy with a stated motivation of sexual identity conversion and as a result they might be drawn to therapists who specialize in “gay conversion therapy.” Usually such therapy is not helpful because the therapist is overly focused on “conversion” when their patient needs a comprehensive psychotherapeutic approach. Such a comprehensive approach seeks to help the survivor understand his thoughts, feelings, and behaviors regarding sexual orientation but would not seek to “convert” the survivor from one sexual orientation to another. The decision about how to identify himself with regard to sexual orientation is left up to the survivor.
It is possible that on some (probably relatively rare) occasions, the survivor might see a therapist who espouses a “gay conversion therapy” philosophy who also provides a comprehensive and ultimately helpful approach to helping the survivor overcome the deleterious effects of childhood sexual abuse. I believe that such outcomes are most definitely the exception rather than the rule and I would never encourage a male survivor of sexual abuse to begin his search for a psychotherapist by looking for “gay conversion therapists”–in fact, I would recommend that he avoid such therapists.
If you wish to understand more about this issue, Dr. Richard Gartner (with whom I have no affiliation) has written an excellent article, intended for mental health professionals, titled, “Sexual Victimization of Boys by Men: Meanings and Consequences” which was published in the Journal of Gay and Lesbian Psychotherapy in 1999. It is fortunately available free online at: http://www.richardgartner.com/SexualVictBoysByMen.pdf
Mark
P.S. A couple of other helpful resources:
MaleSurvivor.org – “We are committed to preventing, healing, and eliminating all forms of sexual victimization of boys and men through support, treatment, research, education, advocacy, and activism.”
GayAffirmativeTherapy.com – “It isn’t enough to be gay friendly, you must be gay informed!” – Information about a book by Joe Kort, Ph.D. that provides education and training in gay affirmative psychotherapy.
Mike the American Psychological association says that gays who positively accept their orientation are happier and better adjusted than those who do not. No one who has suppressed their orientation is doing as well as they would be if they would just accept who they are. It is common for people such as your heterosexually married gay friend to spend many years struggling to be someone they are not only to finally realize in the 40′s or 50′s that they can’t take hiding anymore and they end their marriage devastating the woman they deceived and any children they might have. You should be ashamed of yourself for encouraging gay men to live a lie that will eventually very likely devastate not only them, but others as well.
There has been many studies and there is absolutely no evidence that anyone can change same sex attractions into opposite sex attractions but there is considerable evidence that attempts to do so can lead to depression, self-destructive behavior, and suicide.
Its true that many of these people who’ve attempted to change orientation claim to have succeeded and that they are happy but one must consider who they are and their circumstance to appraise the validity of such claims. Men who seek to change their orientation are almost without exception deeply religious and from a religious background that threatens them with eternal torture for being gay. The desperately seek acceptance of an anti-gay society and fear the hell they’ve been told awaits them so they are highly motivated to claim they’ve changed and they are happy regardless of the reality of the situation. Additionally many of these men may believe its a sin to let gay people believe they can’t come to Jesus by changing their orientation.
You can see the incentive to lie about having changed goes in only one direction. Its no coincidence that not a single one of these people who claimed to have changed have been willing to undergo testing to verify their claims whether its through a no-lie MRI, polygraph, or penile plethysmograph.
As this “therapy” to change sexual orientations is ineffective, potentially harmful, and based on the invalid assumption that gayness is a disease in need of a cure it is the best course for society to ban it just as it now bans other forms of quack therapy that bleed people of their money while causing them harm.
Mike, no one seeks to change their orientation because gayness is a problem, they only seek to change their orientation to avoid the discrmination of an oppressive society and the threat of eternal torture. Changing orientation isn’t the goal, avoiding societal/religious rejection is the goal and these unfortunate people mistakenly believe changing orientation is a means to that end. If you weren’t a hater you would oppose this just as you would oppose people selling “therapies” to self-loathing black people seeking to dye their skin, straighten their hair, and change their facial structure to appear white as a means to end the suffering that results from racism.
You are a hater Mike. Stop promoting and reinforcing the self-loathing that leads people to try and be something they’re not in order to escape the contempt of people such as yourself.
Yes Mike, I’m biased towards reality. I’ve been fighting “ex-gay” lies for almost 15 years. It must hurt you that the majority of people now view reparative therapy as a joke and so-called “ex-gay” programs as a fraud.
We have heard your tired spiel before. Ex-gay programs have less than zero credibility considering their failure rate. How’s that John Paulk thing working out for you? Or Michael Johnston? Or all the other frauds your kind has tied to peddle to the American people.
What you promote is child abuse. And we will stop it before more victims are harmed.
Wayne, anything new about John Paulk lately? Seems like he was imminently about to split up with his wife last summer.
“Enquiring minds want to know”.
Wayne,
You can’t expect these “ex-gay” people to be biased toward reality (like you) when they have so much money to make distorting it! Your points are well presented. Still don’t confse these people with the facts! :-)
Wayne, we have talked before when I responded to an email from TWO.
Although I espouse your position from a ‘truth’ and ‘reality’ perspective,that is, for those ‘out’ gay persons who CHOOSE that life style, there is the problem with a dogmatic background in your dialectic that being gay is a permanent condition from which there is no respite or alternative, If there is ONE exception to your theory, then there may be others, and that pretty much puts you on the defensive. I understand your issues with solid ‘gay pride’ and all of those millions of men and women who have DECIDED they will lead that sexual orientation.
But there are many heterosexual men, and women, who have led successfully straight lives and joyful relationships with persons of the opposite sex, only to find out in later (??) life that they have erotic feelings
toward members of their own gender.
I am a heterosexual man, now, who, when I was a young man, had several long term relationships, with long time male friends, with whom I was sexually involved. Intermittently, I was involved with several women, quite sexually, and almost caused a family feud when I broke off with one girlfriend after a 3 yr. relationship. I have been married twice, to lovely women, with whom I have had three children, all of whom are aware of my past sexual history. I was faithful to both of my wives, with one exception, and I would ask you specifically if that record is equivalent to the gay relationships you are familiar with.
I understand your espousal of gay identity, that is, for those who have found it to be emotionally, socially, and sexually fulfilling. But if there are those who cannot find their niche as a ‘gay’ person, then they are certainly entitled to whatever means effectively helps them realize a straight relationship, however long it may take.
You do realize there’s such a thing as bisexuality right?
Here I found Jeremy S in Texas I had quite a few back and forth comments with him on Warren’s blog http://wthrockmorton.com/2011/11/09/alan-osmond-channels-narth/ If you use the search feature on Warrens Blog he made a lot of comments on another one of those retreats, something called Nobel week-end or something similar.
He appears to be a star “patient” if Nicolosi promoted him to the NY Times.
I just read that whole topic with 150 comments and what struck me is that everyone at Nicolosi’s clinic are all Catholics, except for Nicolosi’s sone who is an Evangelical Protestant. There was some guy commenting over there who said derogatory things about you BTW.
He is also the first video here I am fairly sure
http://www.voices-of-change.org/our-stories.html
Yeah, a few new things on Paulk. :)
Martin:
You are obviously bisexual.
Furthermore, you say, “If there is ONE exception to your theory, then there may be others, and that pretty much puts you on the defensive.”
Well, the same can be said for your point of view. If we can find ONE exception to so-called “ex-gays” who have claimed to be cured but then get caught in gay relationships, that pretty much puts you on the defensive, now doesn’t it?
While we have found many such hypocrites, I have yet to find a genuine ex-gay.
Wayne, as I mentioned beforve, I have spoken with you about many issues, not just ‘gay’ issues. . .I have seen your videos, read your emails and articles and the simple reason I espouse your cause is because of your passion, in which I see a great deal of truth against the hypocrites. That impresses the hell out of me, and I don’t impress easily. The world is abound in hypocrisy.
I think the ‘ex-gays’ issue, along with all human sexual issues, are complex, and labels certainly don’t help people. Hanging things around people’s necks were things the Puritans did at the witch trials in Salem. We are an enlightened society and if you saw my later post concerning ancient Greece, it pretty summarizes my attitudes today about humans and their sexual choices.
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Wayne, with regard to YOUR “one exception” in the case of ‘ex-gays’ it can
only be applied to those who SUCCESSFULLY avoid sexual relations with their own sex – either by choice, which means willpower, or by some form of reparative therapy that achieves that same end. I don’t think it is within your purview to judge the therapies if they are successful – ONLY if they claim success, when it is patently untrue and you find these same persons in relations with same sex persons. As I said, I appreciate your true passion to flush out the phonys, but don’t let it catch you making judgments about those who truly cannot life the ‘gay lifestyle’ nor those who sincerely want to help them avoid it. This is a monumental issue, and because I see both sides of the issue – having been there myself – I think I have been as honest with you as anyone here, considering the circumstances of each of our lives.
Martin, those who “cannot find their niche” as gay persons aren’t having trouble because being gay is a problem, they are having trouble because society oppresses them , discriminates against them, and tells them they are inferior because they are gay. They don’t seek “straight relationships” because there is something preferable about them, they try to be straight because they see that as a means to avoiding the oppression, hate, and stigmatization of a bigotted society.
No one chooses what desires they will have, no one “decides” to be gay as you absurdly assert. The situation you desribe for yourself is not of a heterosexual man, but of a bisexual man. Bisexuals can certainly be happy in a relationship with either sex, bisexuals can certainly choose who their partners will be but we most certainly do not choose our attraction to both sexes and cannot chose not to have same sex attractions.
If you had any concern for gays and lesbians and a sincere desire to let them have whatever lifestyle they desire you’d want to do everything you could to eliminate the societal rejection and stigmatization of gay people and the religious threat of eternal punishment so that gays and lesbians can truly be free to be the people they want to be. But you don’t oppose that oppression, you don’t support equal rights because you really don’t want gays and lesbians to be free to be who they are, you really want them to feel the pressure to change their orientation as a means to avoid the bigotry of people such as yourself.
Priya, for all of your seeming articulate speech and, of course, authoritative judgments as well, you have blatantly ignored several crucial points. You have hung a ‘bigot’ placard around my neck when nothing I said in either of my posts to Wayne expressed a desire to deprive ANYONE of their sexual rights. You said I ‘don’t oppose that oppression’ when you have no evidence of that-first wrong. You said I ‘don’t support equal rights” -no evidence, second wrong. You said I ‘support changing their orientation so as to avoid the bigotry of people such as yourself(me).’ Nowhere in any post I have placed here did you read or hear that I expect anyone to change their sexual orientation(s) [There are more than just two] So your diatribe about my bigotry and denial of equal rights is completely without merit, and I strongly suggest you go back and read, again, what I said in my later post to Wayne.
Your comments highly suggest you are highly emotional about sexuality, willing to blame others for imagined slights, which says much more about you than you let on. Are you a gay man, or a gay woman? I cannot tell from your name.
Contrary to all evidence you have seen and heard, people DECIDE to have sex with anyone, gay or straight. You paint some mechanical and deterministic nightmare of people who have NO CHOICE, and I have to inform you that if the decisions you make constantly make you miserable and unhappy, then you need some deep psychoanalytic therapy, again gay or straight. Your are making sexuality the driver and not the person’s mind and spirit. Abstinence from sex explicitly implies willpower, again, gay or straight. And if you feel that you don’t have that ability, well then someone didn’t teach you well, or you have some bad decision- making habits, especially when it comes to sex.
Person X says m. “I have left the gay lifestyle, and am no longer gay. I am now heterosexual.”
Martin, here are a few question I have now asked 43 times running, including several times here at TWO. I have never received anything but a highly equivocal answer to the question, if I received even that much.
Are you merely no longer having homosexual sex, or having heterosexual sex exclusively..And will you swear on the sacred blood of Jesus, or whatever it is that you hold most holy and inviolable, that You no longer have any homosexual thoughts or desires at all?
crickets my friend. All I EVER hear is crickets.
Well, I guess I’m STILL going to hear crickets.
we’ll up the count to 444.
I would like to inform the general readership here that in ancient Greece, considered by many to be the foundation culture of Western civilization, the expression of sexuality between the sexes and among the sexes reached a ‘pinnacle’ if that is considered the correct word for describing the bisexual nature of human beings.
By placing the blame on all adult sexual expression, be it homosexual or heterosexual, notwithstanding any criminal sexual acts, those groups that stigmatize legal consensual adult sexual behavior automatically pull down on themselves labels such as prude, puritanical, ‘stay out of my bedroom,’and worst of all, deprivation of guaranteed civil rights. LEGAL sexual expression has been painfully legislated for centuries by Western culture, and we will not tolerate the religious right, or any other group to destroy the gains American society and, by extension, the other nations of the world have made( Uganda excepted) in this area. Not only is society finally reaching a true state of equal rights, but as a religio/secular nation that can still function with moral principles regardless of religious affiliation. The pendulum will not swing the other way until these civil rights have been guaranteed full expression as citizens of the US.
The homosexual act of love is NOT a criminal act, for men or women. Maybe it has taken 5,000 years for humans to finally realize that very simple fact. Of course the genetic religious legacy will take a few more generations to reach a level of equanimity with the evolving secular culture. The pluralistic nature of American society certainly holds a promise for that eventuality, Let the current generations be the forerunners for this peaceful and dynamic future we have envisioned.
Martin, you aren’t fooling anyone. You wouldn’t be here trying to convince people gayness is a choice if you didn’t oppose equal rights for gays and think gays should attempt to change their orientation. Your denials mean nothing, your actions say everything. You talk of the idea of being unable to choose not to be gay as a “nightmare” – its obvious given that attitude that you are an anti-gay bigot. You wouldn’t be here talking about people avoiding same sex sex if you weren’t an anti-gay bigot, there is simply no reason whatsoever you’d bring up “reparative” “therapy” if you were willing to acknowledge the truth that no one seeks to change orientation because gayness is the problem but that they seek to change as a means to avoid fear of eternal torture and the rejection of an oppressive anti-gay society (of which you are a shameful part of).
You just said “Contrary to all evidence you have seen and heard, people DECIDE to have sex with anyone, gay or straight.”.
I never said they didn’t, you’re making up things in your mind about what I said. What I said was very specific, that bisexual people can choose their partners but not their desires. The problem is what you originally said was “Although I espouse your position from a ‘truth’ and ‘reality’ perspective,that is, for those ‘out’ gay persons who CHOOSE that life style, there is the problem with a dogmatic background in your dialectic that being gay is a permanent condition from which there is no respite or alternative, If there is ONE exception to your theory, then there may be others, and that pretty much puts you on the defensive.”.
That is wrong. No one chooses to be gay, straight, or heterosexual. Gay people can choose heterosexual partners too, but that won’t stop them from being gay. No one chooses their sexual attractions, one cannot decide to be gay one day and heterosexual the next. I gather from your B.S. talk of “gay identity” you fail to acknowledge that gayness is a state of being, a state of being same sex attracted – gayness is not a matter of how one chooses to label oneself, there is no such thing as a “gay identity”. There has never been a proven example of anyone changing same sex attractions into opposite sex attractions. It is the absolute truth, if you are gay you always will be, you can NEVER change that and the desire to avoid the stigmatization and oppression of an anti-gay society is NEVER a valid reason for us to consider it acceptable when some seek such impossible change.
You say the ‘ex-gays’ label “can
only be applied to those who SUCCESSFULLY avoid sexual relations with their own sex”. This is where you’re being dishonest in the way of anti-gays we’ve become so familiar with. To be “ex-gay” one must have changed their exclusive same sex attractions into exclusively opposite sex attractions. There is no such thing as an “ex-gay”. Like the typical anti-gay bigot you try to tell people gayness is a behavior and that if one stops having gay sex one is no longer gay – that is a lie. A gay person is a same sex attracted person and no matter how much a gay person condemns gay sex, refrains from it, and engages in heterosexual sex they will ALWAYS be gay (same sex attracted). Only an idiot would assume we’re stupid enough to buy the tired old B.S. you’re selling.
You said “Abstinence from sex explicitly implies willpower, again, gay or straight. And if you feel that you don’t have that ability, well then someone didn’t teach you well, or you have some bad decision- making habits, especially when it comes to sex.”.
See how foolish it is for you to try to claim you’re not an anti-gay bigot? (not to mention your laughable use of the term “explicitly implies”) You haven’t given me any reason why I should abstain from sex, THERE IS NO REASON WHY I SHOULD ABSTAIN FROM SEX. If you weren’t an anti-gay bigot you would never suggest I wasn’t well taught or had bad decision making habits because I couldn’t care less about being abstinent. ONLY ANTI-GAY BIGOTS COME TO LGBT SITES AND TALK ABOUT ABSTINENCE AND “REPARITIVE” “THERAPY”.
I wrote to Cameron, the 20 year old man who was saving money to give to a reparative therapist. I sent him a couple of powerful links. He wrote back and thanked me. He said he’s been getting a lot of information sent his way, but he promised he would read it. I hope it saves him from wasting the money I did in my two decades of ex-gay ministry and reparative therapy.